Plan B

General => Suggestions => Closed => Topic started by: Supreme on September 18, 2017, 05:33:11 am

Title: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Supreme on September 18, 2017, 05:33:11 am
Version 1
9/17/2017

UPDATED VERSION
9/18/2017



My suggestion is to give the president the power to:
    - Remove a certain security member    (5 minute cool down period unless current president dies)
(ONLY ALLOWED IF TIMER HAS PASSED 7 MINUTES AND HAS LESS THAN 300 POINTS)

    - Remove all security members            (5 minute cool down period unless current president dies)
(ONLY ALLOWED IF TIMER HAS PASSED 7 MINUTES AND HAS LESS THAN 300 POINTS)

    - Remove 5 minute cool down for a certain security member

    - Remove 5 minute cool down for all security members

    - Security Point System
           ~ Each security member has his own timer. The timer starts after the security member loses his/her first spawn protection. The timer will not reset until there is a new president.(STOPS AT 7 MINUTES AND IS DISPLAYED ON SIDE OF SCREEN) (Text is green if the security member has 300 points or above) (Text is red if security's personal timer has passed 7 minutes and the same security member has less than 300 points)
           ~ Each security member gains 1 point per second AS LONG AS THEIR DISTANCE IS 325 OR CLOSER FROM PRESIDENT (DISTANCE 300 IS MAXIMUM SNIPER RANGE)

    - Add commands                               
                               /fire [ID] 
(COMMAND ONLY WORKS AFTER SECURITY'S PERSONAL TIMER HAS REACHED 7 MINUTES AND SECURITY MEMBER HAS LESS THAN 300 POINTS) (NOT ALLOWED IN NSA MAP)
                               /fireall
(COMMAND ONLY WORKS AFTER SECURITY'S PERSONAL TIMER HAS REACHED 7 MINUTES AND SECURITY MEMBER HAS LESS THAN 300 POINTS) (NOT ALLOWED IN NSA MAP)
                               /rehire [ID]
(COMMAND ONLY WORKS AFTER SECURITY'S PERSONAL TIMER HAS REACHED 7 MINUTES AND SECURITY MEMBER HAS LESS THAN 300 POINTS) (NOT ALLOWED IN NSA MAP)
                               /rehireall
(COMMAND ONLY WORKS AFTER SECURITY'S PERSONAL TIMER HAS REACHED 7 MINUTES AND SECURITY MEMBER HAS LESS THAN 300 POINTS) (NOT ALLOWED IN NSA MAP)
                               /stimer

ALSO: 5 minute cool down will not reset if they try relogging



Commands:

1. If the president feels that: (/fire [ID]
    - a security member has less than 300 points, this individual will be removed.
    (only allowed after security member reaches the 7 minute mark (OWN INDIVIDUAL TIMER))

Message to former security member: The president has chose to remove you from the security team because you have less than 300 security points. Perhaps next time you should obey /duty. You have a 5 minute cool down. You will be allowed to rejoin the security team if the current president dies or if the cool down has finished.
-----
2. If the president feels that: (/fireall])
    - every security member currently on his team has less than 300 points, they will all be removed.
    (only allowed after security member reaches the 7 minute mark (OWN INDIVIDUAL TIMER))

Message to all former security members: The president has chose to remove everyone who has less than 300 points on the security team. Perhaps next time you should obey /duty. You have a 5 minute cool down. You will be allowed to rejoin the security team if the current president dies or if the cool down is finished.
----
3. If the president feels that: (/rehire [ID])
    - he/she wants to remove the 5 minute cool down period from a certain security member that was selected, that security member will be allowed to reclass to security.
    (only allowed after security member has been kicked out)

Message to former security member: You may rejoin the security class. Please type "/rc s" if you wish to be a part of the security team again.
----
4. If the president feels that: (/rehireall)
    - he/she wishes to rehire all the security members that were temporarily kicked out of the security team, they will all be allowed to rejoin.
    (only allowed after security member has been kicked out)

Message to all former security members: You may rejoin the security class. Please type "/rc s" if you wish to be a part of the security team again.
----
5. This command shows: [/sinfo] (THIS COMMAND IS AVAILABLE TO EVERYONE)
(Text is green if the security member has 300 points or above) (Text is red if security's personal timer has passed 7 minutes and the same security member has less than 300 points)
    - Security Member's Name
    - Current Distance Away From President (ONLY AVAILABLE FOR ADMINS AND PRESIDENT)
    - Points
    - Timer



If added, this also means:
    - Admins/mods will no longer be responsible for removing security from their class UNLESS they are BLATANTLY camping at armor/terrorist/civilian spawn OR doing absolutely nothing in regards to protecting the president such as stunting.
    - This also means that security is allowed to kill terrorists who are on the way to kill the president (Minimizing the threat to president beforehand). When I say this, I DO NOT MEAN ALL SECURITY can leave the president. There are always those few security members (1-2 members) that can be a great asset and stop terrorists beforehand.



Reasons I chose to make this:
    - Certain security members do not protect the president.
          ~ Current Solution: /report -> Requires admin/mod to oversee this + requires wait time

    - Certain security members undermine the president by trying to get him killed.
          ~ Current solution: /report -> Requires admin/mod to oversee this + requires wait time

    - Certain security members are being punished even though they are indirectly protecting the president.
          ~ Admin's problem: Certain security members are removed from the class because they REQUIRE ALL security members to be with the president at ALL TIMES unless they are given permission to do something else.
          ~ Scenario 1: A group of terrorists with spas inside a sultan are heading towards the president. A couple security members(1-2) attack the group of terrorists before they reach to the president. Security manages to stop the terrorists from reaching the president.
                      President manages to get even farther away from the terrorists because all threats are eliminated. Thank you security. I definitely would not remove my security.
                      ADMIN ACTION: Follow /duty or I will be forced to remove you.

           ~ Scenario 2: All security members are next to the president who is driving. A group of terrorists with spas inside a sultan are heading towards the president. No one stops them until they are extremely close to the president. President's car blows up. The president dies instantly.
                       President dies even though all security members are next to the president.
                       ADMIN ACTION: Good job security. I'm proud of you :). You stayed next to president.

    - No one else is providing solutions. "Let's just hire more mods" How is that working out?

    - It should be the president's choice who gets the privilege to protect the president. If the president thinks his security is doing a good job, leave them be.



Extra comments:

- I'm presuming that a portion of you are going to say, "leave PTP the way it is! I don't like change." Well, do you have a better solution? If you guys don't like change, then why are there suggestions? Everyone just slaps suggestions with "unnecessary or pls no change to PTP server." How do you expect to make this server better than it already is? I will tweak this suggestion if I find someone with a better version of what I'm suggesting. I will make sure to give credit if I change anything based on your guys' comments.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Ege on September 18, 2017, 08:04:50 am
Regular players should never have such powers that directly affects others' gameplay as there's a high posibility that it will be abused.

-1
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Supreme on September 18, 2017, 08:17:40 am
Regular players should never have such powers that directly affects others' gameplay as there's a high posibility that it will be abused.

-1

If it is abused, who will truly suffer from this? The president. If the president wants to run around by himself, let him be. Who's fault is this? The president.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Madman on September 18, 2017, 08:43:14 am
No bro totally NO,your suggestion is good but it's not useful here,ppls will abuse and rest will leave ptp and play in another server so it's not good.Leave it as it is
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: AruN. on September 18, 2017, 09:02:32 am
Few securities who aren't following duty is much better than having no securities at all. Atleast you can count on someone to defend you, even if they aren't near you.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Supreme on September 18, 2017, 09:11:16 am
No bro totally NO,your suggestion is good but it's not useful here,ppls will abuse and rest will leave ptp and play in another server so it's not good.Leave it as it is

If a president happens to abuse it, they will just end up becoming a terrorist and killing the president. I doubt they would leave. The only one suffering is the president. If he wants to be an idiot, let him be an idiot. A president abusing this feature will be a rare occurrence.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Supreme on September 18, 2017, 09:14:14 am
Few securities who aren't following duty is much better than having no securities at all. Atleast you can count on someone to defend you, even if they aren't near you.

That is entirely up to the president. If he wants to die, let him die. We are all humans. Once he realizes that he's fucked, do you think he's going to do it again?
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Crash on September 18, 2017, 03:00:25 pm
As @Ege said,you are giving precious power to president,which may be in 90% abused. It is a nice idea,but sorry. -1
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Brian_Walker on September 18, 2017, 03:15:47 pm
As @Ege said,you are giving precious power to president,which may be in 90% abused. It is a nice idea,but sorry. -1

Same,..

____________________________________________________________________________
My advice


It will be good for president if he had a command to be unvisible on map for 20-30sec   1 time when he is president
So he can go away from spawn like NSA map  ,because he dies imidently xD , or when are much terorist and 2-3 securitys he dies in spawn or near- again  lol ,....

With this command he would by unvisible and run to his position for this 20-30 sec ,  and not die xD
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Panal_Abeja on September 18, 2017, 03:26:35 pm
good idea
but  -1
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: COBRA on September 18, 2017, 03:56:26 pm
Like as many other said already, its gonna be abused.. -1
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: IDAN on September 18, 2017, 03:58:56 pm
-1
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Shark_The_Helicopter on September 18, 2017, 06:12:07 pm
I am having the gut feeling that this somewhere close to the solid solution we need. But I don't know what to tweak this about in the absolute right direction.

Tbh kicking people out won't really be a efficient solution unless it's someone teamblocking or teamkilling.

Arun is right actually.

Roaming around Securities have a higher chance to actually save the Presi indirectly by engaging with Terrorists outside than not being a Security at all.

Those who would get fired would obviously in the need of spite and being a asshole would turn Terrorist or civillian and would attack the presi with Lethal Force.

This idea would be very useful to avoid teamblocking tho. But I must say this ability must be restricted to a limit.

I also suggest the ability to Promote/Hire SWATS(not the POLICE,the other weakass ones) and Civillians as Securities. Again with a Limit to prevent unbalance.

Whether to allow them to keep their weapons or replace them to security weapons can be discussed.

The Restriction System can be discussed.

I'd suggest that:

Presi has X Authority points. Firing a Security initially takes one point,Promoting/Hiring takes 2 points. Can't Promote/Hire without firing if the class is full or proportionate enough.

The usage has a time limit. Only reusable after 2/3 of the time limit is over.

Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Matt on September 18, 2017, 07:13:18 pm
-1 President does not need such powers
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Supreme on September 19, 2017, 04:24:09 am
^^^^ALL COMMENTS ABOVE THIS POINT ARE REGARDED TOWARDS OLD VERSION^^^^

It appears many of you have concerns that the president will abuse this feature. I, personally, feel like it does not really matter if the president will abuse it because the president would only be fucking himself. The version you are now seeing is different from the last one.

"I'm going to be a troll and remove all of my security. Haha PWNT! Oh wow, there seem to be a lot of terrorists."
*President dies*
"FUCK! I definitely don't want to die again! Since I am capable of learning from my mistake, I'm not going do it again"


So, who really lost in this situation? The president. The president just fucked himself. Congratulations. You played yourself.

Anyways, I updated my original suggestion. This suggestion GUARANTEES that the president will not abuse this feature. However, this will require more code so.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Yash on September 19, 2017, 05:25:15 am
Stop making the gameplay more difficult for the President and maybe try to stick with President and not to roam around in order to rescue people or hunting terrorists.
-1
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Supreme on September 19, 2017, 05:59:24 am
Stop making the gameplay more difficult for the President and maybe try to stick with President and not to roam around in order to rescue people or hunting terrorists.
-1

I wish it were that case Yash, but there is a problem. Some choose to do something about it and some don't. Thus, we must find a solution to push security members into protecting the president. Also, it is not difficult but it depends if you have a security team that is effective. It's not that difficult when security actually does their duty. Keep in mind that this is not a problem that happens once or twice throughout the day. This problem happens EVERY SINGLE ROUND. This is a problem unless you are butt-buddies with a lot of decent players. If not, you're screwed. 
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Shark_The_Helicopter on September 21, 2017, 01:23:43 pm
Just Bumping so this doesn't get buried.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Sumit on November 02, 2017, 12:35:14 pm
No, -1
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: SoLoD on November 02, 2017, 01:04:08 pm
Very interesting suggestion, because president is THE MAN among A MEN on the server. He is above everyone.
But your system is too complicated. You do not need a "points", "distance" and everything else. You just need to give president an option to kick everyone, because no metter how good your system will be (and ur system is not good), you can not catch all situations. If you will play more ptp you will find out that sometimes you need to be very very far away from president to be useful. So, no need to hold a "distance".

Another thing that i want you to think about that you do not suggest us to change the rules. Your suggestion is all about to add a "system". And if you will read the rules from the server (where you are a mod by the way) you will see that your "system" is gonna break that rules. There is not a single word about that "300 meters" distance, so why do i lose that "points" if i am not breaking any rules? Another question is why you think that you need to force security to be "close" to the president, if the very simple rule is telling you that president can send you to another part of the map?

Regular players should never have such powers that directly affects others' gameplay as there's a high posibility that it will be abused.
-1
Can i ask you why mods and admins have that right, right to "affects others` gameplay"?
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Ege on November 02, 2017, 04:41:52 pm

Regular players should never have such powers that directly affects others' gameplay as there's a high posibility that it will be abused.
-1
Can i ask you why mods and admins have that right, right to "affects others` gameplay"?
Because they're picked by the management and they're obligated to use that right only to provide a fair gameplay for everyone. If you think any staff member is using those rights in a bad way, you can simply report him/her. But looking at the shitload of essays you've been posting recently, you won't be pleased with it.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Jonne on December 20, 2017, 03:51:41 pm
This is a good suggestion, and with all of the discussion around the duty rule, we've been looking for alternatives to 'solve' the rule. However, I'm not sure if this would be a good solution. For example, if the president is new and hasn't played the game before, he probably won't know about these commands, and thus won't be using them. Or if he'd use them, he'd probably just be copying what people are telling him to do. If the president is a regular, I feel it would mostly be used to kick new people out of the security team and replace them by their friends. Both of these examples won't have an effect on enforcing /duty, and on top of that it might deter people from staying, since the security class is one of the more 'attractive' classes, and I think that plays a big role in why people keep coming back.

I think basing it on a point system is a good start, and maybe we should expand on that and link it with incentives and rewards, to encourage people to do their duty, instead of punishing them when they aren't. I'm not sure how exactly we would implement this, but I feel a scoring/rating system together with rewards could possibly be a better solution.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Deadman on December 20, 2017, 06:53:43 pm
If jonne thinks its a good idea by keeping the scoring system in mind then I think we got something that can help players to do duty happily but we cant figure out how we can!!
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: IDAN on December 20, 2017, 07:47:26 pm
This is a good suggestion, and with all of the discussion around the duty rule, we've been looking for alternatives to 'solve' the rule. However, I'm not sure if this would be a good solution. For example, if the president is new and hasn't played the game before, he probably won't know about these commands, and thus won't be using them. Or if he'd use them, he'd probably just be copying what people are telling him to do. If the president is a regular, I feel it would mostly be used to kick new people out of the security team and replace them by their friends. Both of these examples won't have an effect on enforcing /duty, and on top of that it might deter people from staying, since the security class is one of the more 'attractive' classes, and I think that plays a big role in why people keep coming back.

I think basing it on a point system is a good start, and maybe we should expand on that and link it with incentives and rewards, to encourage people to do their duty, instead of punishing them when they aren't. I'm not sure how exactly we would implement this, but I feel a scoring/rating system together with rewards could possibly be a better solution.

No No No...

Player who play here must know that each class he have to follow /duty we don't need give prices or Reward to player that follow about something he must to do....
Only punish will solve this problem people new must read rule when the register the server.

Every player have to follow rules,He dont do it? Re-class again? -ban for week. again? ban 1 month.

Only hard punishment will solve this problem.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Darwin on December 21, 2017, 02:20:37 am
+1
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: SwirlyMan on December 21, 2017, 04:21:41 am
Maybe we can add stats like president saved,Best Securities or something. You can get points if the president survived the map, but you cant use /rc s after 6-4mins to prevent abused.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Uthar_Smith on December 21, 2017, 09:47:08 am
No No No...

Player who play here must know that each class he have to follow /duty we don't need give prices or Reward to player that follow about something he must to do....
Only punish will solve this problem people new must read rule when the register the server.

Every player have to follow rules,He dont do it? Re-class again? -ban for week. again? ban 1 month.

Only hard punishment will solve this problem.


Why use punishment when you can solve the problem in a way that is beneficial to everybody? Punishment has been proven to be ineffective many times. This is because punishment (at least in this case) serves as symptom management; it's a tool to fight the symptoms of this problem, but the actual problem still persists. Furthermore:
- We need 24/7 admin coverage to make sure we are consequent
- The rule is vague and everyone will have a different interpretation, causing a lot of unwanted drama and unneeded bad things like players being banned because they happened to have a different interpretation of the rule than the admin online
-If we do this, we can expect another crisis like the armor camping one
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: IDAN on December 21, 2017, 12:31:46 pm
No No No...

Player who play here must know that each class he have to follow /duty we don't need give prices or Reward to player that follow about something he must to do....
Only punish will solve this problem people new must read rule when the register the server.

Every player have to follow rules,He dont do it? Re-class again? -ban for week. again? ban 1 month.

Only hard punishment will solve this problem.


Why use punishment when you can solve the problem in a way that is beneficial to everybody? Punishment has been proven to be ineffective many times. This is because punishment (at least in this case) serves as symptom management; it's a tool to fight the symptoms of this problem, but the actual problem still persists. Furthermore:
- We need 24/7 admin coverage to make sure we are consequent
- The rule is vague and everyone will have a different interpretation, causing a lot of unwanted drama and unneeded bad things like players being banned because they happened to have a different interpretation of the rule than the admin online
-If we do this, we can expect another crisis like the armor camping one

Man that come to troll why you think he cares about Rewards?
Waste of time this system will cost.

Give reward to people who must do their /duty its kind of bullshit.
You don't follow the duty? Ban - and sorry to say it - after 1 ban or 2 or 3 he will learn to follow duty trust me.

I didn't see admin punish person about  unfollow duty - so how you know that wont work?

You said that admins need to be 24/7 online that's bullshit, - you have a lot of Mod's.

idk why you decide that Mod's cant ban aimbot - and cant re-class man who don't /duty (in this topic its good option).

Go comon, i want to see this system work...i want to see how people that new and troll they put shit on this system.

as i said everytime in this server the punishment make to laugh while aimbotter get only 2 months ban. and others hacks 1 month.

GL with this system of reward, i don't think its work.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Judah on December 21, 2017, 02:46:40 pm
No, this is not a good idea because some regulars think that all newbie securities are a basket of retards.

Better than depending on those useless securities.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Luka on December 21, 2017, 04:39:26 pm
-1 President does not need such powers
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Shawkhawk did nothing wrong! on December 21, 2017, 09:02:24 pm
Maybe we can add stats like president saved,Best Securities or something. You can get points if the president survived the map, but you cant use /rc s after 6-4mins to prevent abused.
That might help.

Like some said, new guys will not know those commands,
Regulars can abuse it.

No, this is not a good idea because some regulars think that all newbie securities are a basket of retards.

Better than depending on those useless securities.
Haha unfortunately it's true most of the time. Back when I was new, I used to run dor Hydra while being presi or sec XD
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: BugsBunny on December 21, 2017, 10:58:13 pm
Im kinda positive for this idea,+1 and the way i think,it will be more efficient is that if there is like a mininum requirement of hours to be registered for the president to make this certain action,lets say for example The president has to be registered for more than 20 hours to make that happen,that is maybe a situation to solve it.But overall i think this idea is cool ,i hate when you get killed by your own security,and with the proper measurements we will be able to make this happen.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Shark_The_Helicopter on March 12, 2018, 07:14:15 pm
Bump.
Title: Re: President's Power to Remove Security
Post by: Cyrus_ on June 13, 2018, 07:50:23 pm
-